Lemon Casino - opšta diskusija (strana 4)

I've played yesterday on casino, i've payed to casino 300 euro, withdraw 440. Today i see my account is blocked.

Try to check your email for any explanation from the casino; what could the reason be? And let us know if you have any.

no email recvied i checked spam also

Try to get in touch with them and they should give you some answers. Otherwise, our complaint team will surely try to get involved and help you out. They need to wait for the 14-day timeframe, though, as you probably already know. Keep us informed about any changes, please.

When I was making my account I’ve (by mistake) put my last name as my nickname (because it was written nick which to me means nickname)

Now, I’m trying to withdraw 3000$ and the casino I’m playing on tell me that my name is wrong compared to my id sent and this is a break of they’re rules

I’ve said to them that this was a mistake and I can send them every documents they want to prove my identity and this was a mistake and now I’m waiting for them

do you guys think I should be fine or not?

And what did you write as your last name, though? Did you contact the support as soon as you found out about this mistake? It is very important to do so and try to fix this kind of mistake straight away.

Please let us know how the casino approaches this issue and if you will need some help from our complaint team.

We'll wait for your reply here.

They’ve sent me an email to say it was okay but I needed to continue my KYC asking for a picture of me with my id and a paper with the casino name with picture of my credit card and also a confirmation paper of the transaction on my credit card but the operation on my credit card is like 115$ when I got 100$ on the casino so I wonder if this is gonna complicate the process and also my bank just do statement every 28 of the month so I can only sent them a picture of the transaction (with all details) when they were asking for an official document

still waiting for they’re answer after sending all documentation but I wonder if this payment confirmation is gonna give me trouble

This is actually a standard verification process. You need to provide all the documents needed in the right format and of good quality in order to pass the process and be able to get the withdrawal.

So, please send them all the documents whenever possible and keep us informed about the whole process.

Romi please don't reject my negative review this time. Reason you mentioned rejecting my previous review makes me think that you didn't read it.

This guys should be in the last places. I am objective.

Hope casino.guru doesn't lobbying them for any reason.

I really wondered why this casino has "very high" safety index and rating... guess casino.guru is independent enough not to artificially raise it's rating.

Even 3 star rating in trustpilot is "artificial".

I just found out their methods )

I am SURE that in casino.guru they do have subjectively overrated "safety index" also.

I just read your review for this casino and hopefully can explain to you why it was rejected.

The actual valuable thing we have learned from it was that you had problems with the bonus due to the fact that you have exceeded the maximum bet. It is always important to read the bonus terms so you can avoid future issues.

The user reviews are supposed to be about players experience from the casino, good or bad, relevant to the situation they had, but the casino doesn't deserve to be punished with low rating just because you violated the terms.

I hope that you can understand my point. You can write about it here, on the forum, so others can read about it and make their own opinion about this casino.

Also, please read our article about How do we review online casinos, so it can help you to better understand the ratings (safety indexes) of the casinos included on our website.

Dear Romi

I clearly understand your point.

Believe me, you will hardly find more than 3-4 gamblers in whole forum with more experience. I didn't count... but it will be over 50-60 casinos and thousands hours of gameplay.

My review was not about their bonus rules and how bad are they. Yes, I spoke about my violation, right. But I spoke how it should be "punished" according to exact casino's T&Cs. So don't pretend to be judge please if you didn't examined the case properly. My review was about this exact casino VIOLATING their own terms.

Terms and Conditions - lemon.casino:

Point 18. 10. : "10. The maximum stake (also in internal Games of main Games such as Gamble and/ or mini-Games) can not be higher than € 2 (or equivalent in other currencies) until full turnover is made. Higher than admissible rates (before full turnover), will not be taken into account."

That means they should reduce the balance in my account by corresponding amount- total bets and wins from bets over 2 EU, but not confiscate it totally.

Then comes following: "In cases of irregular gameplay, where players deliberately employ exploitative tactics to gain an unfair advantage against the house edge, Lemon Casino reserves the right to void requested withdrawals, confiscate winnings, cancel bonus funds, and/or terminate the player's". So it could not be classified as "Irregular gameplay". And if a player have only violation staking over 2EU this means that only the first part of point 10 is applicable. But they just didn't bother to calculate bets and winnings to reduce from my balance and they remove all my balance instead.

I don't really care about that pour 1100 EU, I deposit and withdraw several like that in a month. I just can't stand injustice. "Terms and Conditions" of any casino is a part of public offer - it is the contract the agreement concluded between player and casino. And casino must follow them strictly.

I offen come across legislation in the area of financial and civil laws in my line of work, I (we) have won quite serious cases in court that are incomparable in complexity and amounts with cheap games, and I clearly understand that cases are considered here extremely superficially, sometimes subjectively.

Returning to point 18.10... and T&Cs in total.

"We consider the casino's T&Cs to be fair"... really??)

Please re-check T&Cs of lemon.casino.

I have played in dosesns casinos, where the terms and conditions are much "better", but here in casino.guru they are rated as "not fair". Based on this, I hardly can believe your impartiality.

Maybe my English is not good enough but I hope I wrote it clearly enough.

You surely wrote everything clear enough here, and I get your point as well.

I have an offer for you, though. What about instead of writing about all this in the user review, you write it in your complaint?🤔

Did you know that it is free of charge to file a complaint here with our team? They could help you out with your issue at this casino.

I know that our specialists could take a better look at this situation and maybe get some solution to your issue.

If you are up to it and would like to give it a chance, just follow this link to file a complaint, and I will surely keep my fingers crossed for you that our complaint team will be able to help.🤞

Please let me know how you decide. I will wait for your reply.

Thank you for your advice, Romi

I insist my review to be published.

In my firm opinion, this casino deserves not only negative review but also serious downgrade in safety index wich is extremely overrated. I am a dissatisfied client (reasonable) and want my experience to be shared here to others. Isn't it one of the basic missions of casino.guru? in any case, under certain circumstances, the review may be changed, if the casino accepts that their actions are clumsy and do not correspond to either their own T&Cs or the practices of a civilized gaming community.

As for claiming a complaint, to say the truth I don't believe that there will be a fair verdict regarding this case here.

I have at least two reasons to say that:

1. I clearly see some lobbying to this casino. I guess, because it's in your partner's list.

2. When a violation from a player took place, as a rule these cases are resolved in favor of the casino without going into detail what exact sanctions (penalties) and actions should have been taken by the casino based on the T&Cs of the same casino.

You helped too many gamblers- that's true. But only in obvious cases where everything was simple. And you will hardly resolve a case if there not that obvious that casino is not right especially if this casino in your partner's list.

I may claim a complaint later, not sure, just to test how will it work here. ) Or I may complain directly to Curaçao Gaming Control Board, even if it is a "weak" regulator. In my opinion, a casino that manipulates its own T&Cs and takes advantage of the opportunity to avoid paying customers should not operate at all.

However, they took my time and some nerves- and they will get an asymmetric response. )) I will even spend another one or two 1100 EU but will make them have much much more losses. It's more important for me than making them fulfill their obligations concerning my case.

Can you please answer me, why don't you want a negative review to be posted for this exact casino??

If I may step in, I would like to point out you both say the same things when it comes to the review.

Would you agree?

Romi: What about instead of writing about all this in the user review, you write it in your complaint.

You: Yes, I spoke about my violation, right. But I spoke how it should be "punished" according to exact casino's T&Cs. So don't pretend to be judge please if you didn't examined the case properly. 

So basically put, user review is not about how you feel the casino should be treated for their errors. User reviews, as Romi pointed out already, allow players to share the experiences - not assumptions. Furthermore, what you call a "case" is actually the complaint not the aforementioned user review.

Thus, in order to "examined the case properly" submit one just here 👈.

In order to get your review approved, stick with a description of the events that occurred in the casino. Rather than focusing on your extensive casino experiences and assuming how likely are third parties are to address your complaint. None of this is actually an aspect of a user review.

This is what prevents us from approving it.

I believe we are ready to understand each other, are we?

I'm a bit confused by your inconsistent statements, to be honest.

Why did you come here in the first place if you believe that we are lobbing for casinos? You are very mistaken here, despite you're ready to use words as "Isn't it one of the basic missions of casino.guru". I'm sorry to see you are not very familiar with our mission. Let me help you with that, because this is precisly what we do.

First of all: Informing instead of promiting - how would you inform players about online casinos without listing the casinos' names and associated details?

Thus, we created the list.

Secondly - I strongly advise you to read your Fair Gambling Codex - both versions, so we can keep discussing the real points instead of your missinformed opinions you have gathered about Casino Guru.

Now to the breached max bet limit (it is mentioned in your codex):

"The max bet rule is, in fact, an industry standard, just as the fact that a casino has the right to seize the player's winnings from bonus play after breaking this rule. We prefer not to go against industry standards by penalizing casinos that use the maximum bet rule against players from time to time.

On the other hand, we think that this rule should be enforced at the software level, i.e., that the casino's software or website shouldn't let players place higher bets than the limit. This is one of our requirements for 'fair and safe casinos'.

If software enforcement is not possible, each case should be judged separately, so that only players who have broken the rule knowingly and systematically to gain an advantage are punished.

Additionally, the max bet sizes should be clearly displayed, ideally in the casino lobby or directly in the games (if possible) or on a prominent part of the page or advertisement informing them about the bonus, and not just "hidden" in the rules for bonus play. It is a common practice to only list the max bet in Bonus T&Cs, but we appreciate when casinos make them more visible and easier to follow."

As you can see, we are ready to evaluate your complaint once it is submitted. Protecting casinos is not our interest at all.

If you, however, still think submitting a complaint is a lost cause because our specialists are not capable of understanding, we will respect your choice, yet further debate would most likely have no sense at all.

Shall we put all this aside and act like reasonable, open-minded people, please? We aim to help you.

Dear Radka

"you didn't examined the case properly" - English is just one of languages I know and it's not perfect: "case" I meant "situation" in this.. case.)

"inconsistent statements"?

There is nothing inconsistent in my "statements" all my statements were clear and reasonable.

"First of all: Informing instead of promiting - how would you inform players about online casinos without listing the casinos' names and associated details?"

Hmm.. what are your talking about? did I say anything about listing? of course, without listing it is not possible to reach the goals of casino.guru. I appreciate detailed listing of casinos in casino.guru. My doubts are about some unfair high Safety indexes and about blocking some reviews for some casinos..

Overall my opinion about casino.guru. I don't want you catch me wrong. I still like this website and would advise to my friends. Otherwise I would not post reviews here. Even more, I think this is a N1 resource in the theme of gambling in the whole web and my favorite in the theme. But at the same time I am a big boy already) and I realize - nothing is perfect in the world. "Lobbying" maybe is a little exaggerated said. May, I am wrong, but I have an impression that you are a little bit "loyal" to those casinos who may order advertising here. And as I said: first it's your wish of rejecting negative reviews, as we see it clearly... second, I clearly see that lemon.casino doesn't deserve even medium Safety Index. But in your website it's "Very high"? Really? Are you sure?

"On the other hand, we think that this rule should be enforced at the software level, i.e"

Yes, I agree! In the most of casinos (even much smaller) it's enforced to software level + in some others you can see the note about maximum bet written with big letters every time you login a game if you have a bonus. So what criterias you check if you granted this lemon "Very High"? None of double standards?

"In order to get your review approved, stick with a description of the events that occurred in the casino. Rather than focusing on your extensive casino experiences and assuming how likely are third parties are to address your complaint. None of this is actually an aspect of a user review"

Are you serious?? I wrote about exact situation. The exact situation when the casino (a casino with unfairly strict bonus rules and dumb software) confiscated my winnings ignoring it's own T&Cs! Is there anything more important that can be useful for potential clients? Is there anything worse to rate this lemon up to zero?

Yes, I wish that negative review downgrade it's rating even if I have claimed a complaint (it doesn't matter what will be result).

The interesting part is: for other casinos you can approve stupid negative reviews with arguing about low RPT (sure you know, that's nonsense) or someone else just didn't like casino name even reviewer confess he didn't play there for example, but some other casinos are untouchable - negative review doesn't been approved even being reasonable. It's so obvious.

Radika, why do you Again try prevent publishing this??? Sure ) this fact doesn't prove my doubts about your "loyalty" to some casinos, it's my rich imagination

"specialists are not capable of understanding"

I didn't mean that. I'll explain: in most cases when any third party arbitration specialists (not only here, in askgamblers, for example, also) meet the word "violation" and it's proved, they don't bother to review it further.. I have read some cases in different resources including here. It's not about competency, but mostly stereotypes: "oh this guy violated terms and still wants to have cash out, no man! I am a strict orbiter! I will reject his complaint and will recommend this guy to be more attentive to rules".))

Ok. I am a gambling person by nature. I will claim a complaint here. It becomes interesting to what result we will come.

BUT I have a request: please don't leave my review in pending status "until case is solved". Just publish my review. It's MY REASONABLE opinion, MY experience wich will be useful for many users.

Hello.

Thank you for staying in touch.

Allow me to add a few points I feel should be mentioned to follow up with your response.

Many players come here with advice on how high or low specific Safety Indexes should be, and I can assure you we appreciate good suggestions for improvements. Frankly, it's also very common for those players that they are not very familiar with how the Safety Index is calculated. Thus, I believe it is a valid point requiring an explanation.

"My doubts are about some unfair high Safety indexes and about blocking some reviews for some casinos.."

As you may see in the tab called "Safety Index explained":

Complaints are one of the most important source for the calculation. Now I understand you may see our efforts to suggest the free of charge complaint of every fitting occasion as a way to support casino, yet the truth is exactly the opposite outcome. We always care for more complaints to be submitted, not just to help players but also to investigate how the casino approaches players' concerns or whether the terms are interpretated fairly - this is where the Fair Gambling Codex came from. I would also like to mention many casinos already hate us for being so strict when it comes to fairness. Just as you think we favor the casinos, the casinos think we favor the players too much.

User reviews are a great source of good information for others, even though they are not part of the Safety Index. Our goal is to approve as many user reviews as possible, but still, each review just needs to provide handy, unbiased information to be approved.

From my personal experiences, I can say openly that sometimes it is extremely difficult for us to decide whether the review meets our guidelines. The pressure to always make a fair, or if you prefer, good, decision is high. We try to stick with a few basic values to achieve fair decisions. I would like you to know I have no reason not to believe your nobel cause to prevent others from having the same experience you had. You may also like to know the amount of very positive reviews we reject daily is quite high. Needless to say, our efforts are focused on keeping the user rating unbiased, whether we are talking about positive or negative reviews.

Skilled players like you are an important part of our community, and the situation you have been through seems to be very complex. I came up with the idea to discuss your review through an e-call with the rest of the Community Team to ensure the best possible outcome.

In light of that, I suggest we get back to you soon after the call which has been schedule for today's afternoon.

If I may, I still think submitting the complaint is a good call.

See you later.

I'm back with the promised development and I hope you will be pleased.

Let's begin with the fact that your second review submitted on Lemon Casino was approved. We all took into account your experience from the standpoint of the user, which may not always align with the final result.

Perhaps you would be interested to know what part of your experience played the most vital part:

We agreed that a maximum bet of two can easily lead to confusion because the industry standard is typically five.

The max bet rule is not enforced - definitely a bad experience

Since you claimed to have told the casino about your error in an honest manner, we would anticipate a more accommodating action from the casino.

The rule you mentioned does state that higher bets will not be included in the wagering while the bonus is active, even though it is probably poorly written.

Violating the max bet rule has nothing to do with "irregular gameplay", it makes little sense and as a result, it only declares poor user experience

Even though we agreed, the casino is free to set the maximum bet freely, and players should always read the terms, considering all the aforementioned points, we understand it must have been quite bad experience for you and agreed with you it should be shared.

Another intriguing detail I have discovered is that, although I can not say for sure, the rule Point 10. was changed in response to this circumstance, it currently reads as follows:

"10. The maximum stake (also in internal Games of main Games such as Gamble and/ or mini-Games) can not be higher than € 2 (or equivalent in other currencies) until full turnover is made. Higher than admissible rates (before full turnover), will not be taken into account. In cases of irregular gameplay, where players deliberately employ exploitative tactics to gain an unfair advantage against the house edge, Lemon Casino reserves the right to void requested withdrawals, confiscate winnings, cancel bonus funds, and/or terminate the player's account."

It is, in my opinion, a very peculiar one. I still like to believe submitting the complaint may help you get the amount voided, even though you clearly said it was not your interest.

I will stop bothering you about it. 🙂