Zdravo!
Imao sam neugodan incident s Playouwinom koji sam pronašao na Aksgamblersu i gdje sam nakon toga podnio žalbu protiv kazina. Opis slučaja, cijelu priču o žalbi s odgovorima Playouwina i Askgamblersa možete pronaći ovdje:
https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/playouwin-casino-the-casino-added-an-unclaimed-bonus-to-my-account-and-confiscated-my-winnings-afterwards
Pripremio sam svoj odgovor u vezi s kršenjem Playouwinovih pravila i odredbi, ali kada sam to pokušao objaviti, vidio sam da je žalba zatvorena bez daljnje mogućnosti da se ponovno otvori ili ponovo razmotri. Ovde objavljujem tekst svog odgovora:
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U svom prvom odgovoru, predstavnik Playouwina je rekao: '' radimo u skladu s našim uslovima i odredbama bonusa ''. Ali u njihovom drugom odgovoru čitamo: 'radimo izuzetke i ovo je bio jedan i jedini od njih'. Dakle, uvjeti se ponekad poštuju, a ponekad ne ... Čini se da kladionica odlučuje hoće li raditi po njenim uslovima ili naprotiv - reći „ovo kršenje je samo izuzetak".
Tehnički dio ovog incidenta zanimljiv je s obzirom na to da se kladionica pretvara da je prekršila zahtjeve za bonus, iako je na računu igrača jasno vidljivo da ih nema. Ali tehnički dio je samo posljedica, a razlog je pravnog karaktera koji je kladionica učinila zbog nedostatka razumijevanja da se pravila trebaju poštivati onako kako su napisana. Napravit ću kratku digresiju ukazujući na glavne točke odnosa 'kladionica-igrač' nakon čega ću se vratiti na pravni dio ovog slučaja.
Uslovi kladionice, nakon što ih igrač prihvati, imaju snagu ugovora između dvije strane. Rezultirajuće obaveze su imperativ, odnosno obavezno je da dvije strane poštuju pravila onako kako su napisana. Nije dopušteno primijeniti ih selektivno ili ih zanemariti. Nemoguće je da bilo koja od strana ugovora prema svom nahođenju napravi 'izuzetke' izražene u postupcima suprotnim onima napisanim u pravilima. U slučaju da kladionica želi poduzeti radnje izvan granica ugovora, ima priliku promijeniti uvjete i tek nakon što igrač prihvati te promjene, nova pravila postaju primjenjiva.
U kladioničarskoj industriji postoji određeni nalog za aktualiziranje odredbi i uslova, a to je sljedeće:
1. Kladionica postavlja novu verziju na web stranicu s datumom stupanja na snagu.
2. Kladionica na neki način obavijesti igrače o promjeni - e -poštom, porukom ili prilikom prijavljivanja - i zamoli ih da se upoznaju s novim pravilima i prihvate ih kako bi nastavili koristiti usluge kladionice.
3. Igrač sa svoje strane upoznaje se s novom verzijom i bira hoće li ih prihvatiti i nastaviti svoju aktivnost ili ne i napustiti kladionicu.
U konkretnom slučaju:
Da biste dodali bonus (bonus naime, a ne poklon!) Na moj račun za klađenje u Playouwinu, potrebno je promijeniti barem dvije stvari:
1. Moj status bi trebao ići od 'NEMAM pravo' na 'Ovlašteno'. Moj status je regulisan u odeljku 1.10 Playouwin -ovih uslova bonusa, odnosno ovaj odeljak je potrebno urediti.
2. Potrebno je promijeniti i redoslijed pripisivanja bonusa na račun igrača. U ovom trenutku igrač mora to zatražiti. Vjerojatno bi bila dobra ideja da se bonusi dodaju na inicijativu kladionice i da se urede odgovarajući dijelovi pravila relevantni za različite vrste bonusa.
U kratkom vremenskom periodu od korištenja Playouwinove web stranice nisam bio obaviješten o promjeni njihovih odredbi i uslova. Valjanost odjeljka 1.10 pravno onemogućava utvrđivanje bilo kakvog bonus odnosa između mene i Playouwina. Dakle, na moj račun se ne mogu pripisati bonus angažmani.
Vjerujem da će Playouwin poštivati njihova vlastita pravila i vodeći se zdravim razumom složit će se da se pravila moraju pridržavati apsolutno i bezuvjetno. Dimenzija posljedica njihovog kršenja odredbi (koje je Playouwin već priznao kao "iznimku") iznosi 1.020,42 € koje je potrebno vratiti na moj račun.
Hello!
I had an unpleasant incident with Playouwin that I found on Aksgamblers and where afterwards I submitted a complaint against the casino. The description of the case, whole story of the complaint with Playouwin and Askgamblers’ replies you can find here:
https://www.askgamblers.com/casino-complaints/playouwin-casino-the-casino-added-an-unclaimed-bonus-to-my-account-and-confiscated-my-winnings-afterwards
I prepared my reply regarding Playouwin’s violation of their own terms and conditions but when I tried to post it I saw the complaint had been closed with no further possibility to be reopen or reconsidered. I post here the text of my reply:
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In their first reply, Playouwin’s representative said: ‘'we work in compliance per our bonus terms and conditions'. But in their second reply we read: 'we do exceptions and this was one and only of them'. So, the terms are sometimes respected and sometimes they are not… It seems that the bookmaker is who decides whether to work according to its terms or on the contrary – to say ‘this violation was just an exception.’
The technical part of this incident is interesting with the fact that the bookmaker pretends of violated bonus requirements although in the player’s account is clearly visible that there are none. But the technical part is just a consequence and the reason is of a legal character that the bookmaker did because his lack of understanding that the rules should be followed just as they are written. I will make a very short digression pointing out the main points of the 'bookmaker-player' relationship after which I will return to the legal part of the present case.
The bookmaker’s terms and conditions, after their acceptance by the player, have the power of a contract between the two parties. The resulting commitments are imperative, i.e. it is obligatory for the two parties to respect the rules just as they are written. It is not permissible to apply them selectively or to ignore them. It is impossible for either one of the sides of the contract to make at his discretion ‘exceptions’ expressed in actions contrary to those written in the rules. In case the bookmaker wants to take actions outside of the contract’s boundaries, he has the opportunity to change the terms and only after the player accept these changes the new rules become applicable.
There is a certain order in the betting industry for actualizing the terms and conditions and it is the following:
1. The bookmaker posts the new version on the website pointing the date they enter into force.
2. The bookmaker somehow notify the players of the change – with an email, a message or when logging in – and ask them to get familiar with the new rules and accept them in order to continue using the bookmaker’s services.
3. The player on his side get familiar with the new version and choose whether to accept them and continue his activity or not and leave the bookmaker.
In the specific case:
In order to add a bonus (a bonus namely, not a gift!) to my betting account in Playouwin, there are at least two things that need to be changed:
1. My status should go from ‘NOT entitled’ to ‘entitled’. My status is regulated in section 1.10 of Playouwin’s Bonus terms and conditions, i.e. this section needs to be edited.
2. The order of crediting a bonus to a player’s account needs to be changed, as well. At the moment the player needs to claim it. Probably it would be a good idea if the bonuses are added on the bookmaker’s initiative and the corresponding sections of the rules relevant to the different types of bonuses should be edited.
During the short period of time I have been using Playouwin’s website I have not been informed of a change in their terms and conditions. The validity of section 1.10 make it legally impossible to determine any bonus relationship between me and Playouwin. So, no bonus engagements could be imputed to my account.
I believe that Playouwin will respect their own rules and guided by the common sense they will agree the rules should be followed absolutely and unconditionally. The dimension of the consequences from their violation of the terms (already admitted by Playouwin as an ‘exception’) is in the amount of €1,020.42 that needs to be restored to my account.
Automatski prevedeno: