Lucky Legends Casino - Zahtev za povlačenje igrača je odbijen.

Hello,

I am fully verified at this casino and never made a withdrawal although I checked if they needed me to send anything before making any request and they reassured me I was good

I used a casino bonus with my deposit that was a no wagering no max cash out only slots bonus… I deposited $60 to which the reload bonus was $200 deposit so I got $198, I won about $2,400+ and made a withdrawal request for the amount of $2,000 via BTC … I then played the remaining $400 with table games and lost the remaining amount anyway. Shortly after the casino rejected my withdrawal request for the $2,000 because I started playing table games with the remaining $400…. I’d like to point out that I only played slots when I wagered and won the $2000+ and most definitely didn’t play table with the 2,000 I requested so I don’t understand how that could be held against me when I made a withdrawal request already before I played with the remaining funds I had

Dear Msmaniire,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I’m sorry to hear about your problem. I checked the Lucky Legends Casino’s Terms and Conditions and this is what I found:

All Deposit Bonuses: Standard Wagering Requirements

4. If the Player uses a promotional bonus that is restricted to certain game(s), this will result in their winnings being voided. The rules of the bonus will continue to apply even after the playthrough requirement has been fulfilled.

10. No Play/ No Max bonuses: Unless otherwise stated, No Play/ No Max bonuses may only be used to play Slots, Keno, Bingo, and Scratch Card games. All other casino games are prohibited and restricted.

11. Playing a prohibited or restricted game while using a bonus will void any winnings generated during the use of a said bonus. These terms are valid and applicable even after the playthrough requirement has been met. All Deposit Bonuses for Slots and Keno with No Restrictions (No Playthrough and No Max Cash-Out) come with our software minimum of 1X playthrough (deposit + bonus amount) before the funds can be withdrawn.

Could you please advise if you were aware of the fact that the bonus rules were applicable even after the wagering requirements have been met? Have you been notified by any system warning that you were about to play a restricted game that would void all your winnings?

I hope we will be able to help you solve your issue as soon as possible. Thank you in advance for your reply.

Best regards

Veronika

No I was not aware that these rules applied even after the wagering requirements have been met.

Especially when the withdrawal request I made was played from slots and I ended up losing the remaining amount I had and No there was no warning pop ups that appeared when I started playing table games with the remaining funds I had.

nothing restricted me from playing table games and it normally would

The $2,000 withdrawal request I made was taken out of my total balance when I made the payout request because there is a $2,000 maximum cash out using Coindraw Btc. Therefore the remaining funds I started playing with were already separated from my Cashout request, I had no plans on withdrawing the remaining $300-400 funds that I had

Thank you Veronica

Thank you very much, Msmaniire, for providing all the necessary information. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Branislav (branislav.b@casino.guru) who will be at your assistance. I wish you the best of luck and hope to see your problem resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.

Here are screenshots of my winnings on my transactions since it’s now deleted and they’ve removed it from my transaction history completely.

and this is what my transaction history looks like as of today

Hello, just following up for any updates ?

Hello, Msmaniire,

I am sorry to hear about your unpleasant experience, and I apologize for the delay. I will contact the casino and try my best to resolve the issue as soon as possible. Now I would like to invite Lucky Legends Casino's representative to join this conversation and participate in the resolution of this complaint.

Dear Lucky Legends Casino team,

Could you please provide us with an explanation of the player's situation in more detail? If we are talking about a breach of the casino's Terms and Conditions, is the casino able to substantiate its decision with relevant evidence? Can you please provide us with the complainant's game logs and transaction history?

It is possible to share the data directly here, with your reply, or by sending them to my email address (branislav.b@casino.guru).

Thank you in advance for providing the information.

Hello is there any updates ?

It’s incredibly disappointing to have to go through lengths just to receive winnings…. I’ve never made a withdrawal from this casino… I’ve only made deposits and it’s never a problem for them to take our real earned money but as soon as we win we have to go through the most just to receive it…..

We would like to ask the casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.

Msmaniire, just letting you know that I am extending the timer for the casino once again and providing it with a few more days to respond since the casino representative usually replies without problems. I will contact them in every available way possible. However, if no response or relevant information is provided until the end of the current timer, the complaint will be closed as unresolved in accordance with the information in my previous post.

Thank you for your patience and understanding.

Dear Lucky Legends Casino team,

Can you please look at my post added on July 3, 2023, and provide us with the requested details?

Greetings all,

Thanks so much for your patience. We have reviewed the situation and as you were informed via live chat Msmaniire the withdrawal was denied due to playing non-allowed games (49.9% blackjack) on a slots and keno only deposit coupon. To avoid such disappointments we have a pop-up on all coupon redemptions clearly stating the associated rules which the player must review and agree to before coupon redemption. We have included a screenshot of the pop-up below as seen on the player end.

Also as mentioned during your service interaction the cash deposit associated with the win was re-deposited as cash into your player account with the deposit bonus of your choice. That balance was then played down to zero and an additional loyalty chip was also requested, deposited, and played based on this deposit afterward.

Unfortunately in this case there is little we can do to assist.

Supporting documentation has been provided to the casino.guru team for review.

Best wishes,

Lucky Legends

Thank you for the explanation, Lucky Legends team.

I am only waiting for additional details requested outside of the thread.

Dear Msmaniire,

Allow me please to sum up the gathered information:

• We are talking about a non-withdrawable bonus with very low or no wagering requirements, so you wagered the funds the minimum number of times, and after the bonus funds conversion, since the bonus funds were not deducted upon conversion, they were still a part of your balance (logically, bonus rules applied)
• You were informed about the validity of bonus rules by pop-up upon coupon redemption
• Playing Blackjack gives a significant advantage, otherwise, it likely would not be possible to accumulate the disputed winnings in such an amount
• Basically, by accepting the casino's solution (restored funds - your deposit was returned, and the same deposit bonus was used) and using the bonus funds while complying with the bonus rules, it looks like you realized the mistake and a breach of the casino's terms and conditions made with the previous bonus
• Another chance was provided to you, and you were allowed to play with your deposit and any deposit bonus despite previous bonus rules violations, but unfortunately, everything was lost

In the meantime, I requested additional minor details from the casino representative and am waiting for them.

However, if the above claims are completely confirmed, I am afraid we will not be able to help you with the issue. What do you expect as a solution to this complaint if you already played with the bonus once again and lost all funds by playing?

No that is not true Branislav

as I stated above I did NOT play blackjack to get to that balance I had I won that all from slots and I made the initial withdrawal request of $2000 strictly from playing slots and I had a remaining $300-400 funds which I then played blackjack with and lost…. My point was simply that I made the withdrawal request before I played blackjack and even then lost the $400 remaining balance I had in blackjack… and I don’t understand the 2nd chance thing because I never agreed to not getting this issue resolved

Dear Msmaniire,

Based on the data and explanation provided earlier, it looked like my summary above. However, although I was provided with further information and evidence, I indeed cannot claim for sure that everything was completely confirmed.

I requested additional evidence from the casino representative, and I am waiting for his reply.

Dear Lucky Legends Casino team,

Could you please take a look at our external conversation and provide me with the required details?

We would like to ask the casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.

this is the game slot I won over $2000 on, NOT from having " advantage from blackjack " I won strictly from playing this slot. I was then only limited to make the maximum withdrawal of $2,000 so that is why I had remaining balance that I did not even plan on cashing out. I already made the 2,000 withdrawal request before I started playing blackjack from which I lost all 

here are screenshots of the proof, I made a $2,000 withdrawal request after i won from slots, it took out of my balance and they took a very long time to approve it and that’s when I decided to play black jack on the remaining $321 I had and there was a $100 processing fee from withdrawals and that already got taken out along with the $2000 as well

And as far as the 2nd chance they claim they had given me, I never agreed to not getting my case resolved I was in fact told over the phone that I’d receive a call back from a manager and I never did. Them putting that money in there and taking $2,000 from me has nothing to do with the issue. I never agreed to that 2nd chance as far as I’m concerned they just put that there. I don’t understand how I’m violating anything when the balance that I made a request on was already taken out of my account and I had no plans on cashing out the remaining $321 and they also already charged me $100 processing fee and already approved the payout then they denied it shortly after…. It’s simply not fair… it was not fault they had a maximum cash out of $2,000 … they are trying to find any reason not to payout because I could’ve just cashed out all 2,321 and instead I had a remaining balance that I didn’t intend on withdrawing so I lost $321 in blackjack and that’s being held against me?

Hello, Msmaniire,

Alright, I understand it completely. Therefore the complaint is still open and we are waiting for additionally requested details from the casino representative.

Now the bad news.

Unfortunately, I was informed that the casino representative is experiencing health problems, so this is the reason he has not been fully available for a longer time, and replies were delayed.

However, since an open complaint will keep the casino's attention, there is no other relevant contact for the casino, and we are talking about a person that usually helps us in resolving complaints without issues, now I will extend the timer by a longer period and provide the casino representative with more time to recover and return to help us.

I am aware it must be frustrating for you, but in this case, I sincerely hope for your patience and understanding.

Now let's please stay patient and positive, and I believe the casino will get back to us soon.

Once I have any news or an update, I will inform you as soon as possible. I am sorry for the inconvenience caused.

Understood,

health is more important, I do hope he’s ok and I wish him a speedy recovery 🙏🏼🙏🏼

Greetings all,

We as an organization have done everything humanly possible to assure that players are aware of the rules they are playing under and to provide full transparency regarding these rules, there is nothing hidden. Quite the opposite, the player is forced to directly sign off on these rules every time a bonus coupon of any variety is redeemed. In this case the rules were broken, the requested withdrawal was denied, the player was informed of the decision (accepting or not) and informed the funds were placed back in the account.

Had there been a bountiful win on those funds this would be an entirely different conversation, the player would be paid that mountain of funds.

Had you chose to stand your ground and leave those funds in the system Msmaniire there may be a chance however slim of negotiating something in your favor. However, the refunded cash deposit was played with knowledge and intent to win. Regardless of the other circumstances surrounding this situation the winning deposit itself is no longer in the system to debate. It was played to zero free and clear.

Apologies, however our opinion stands that in this case there is little to be done to assist.

Best wishes,

Lucky Legends

yes I understand this casino is doing everything possible to find loopholes to not pay players I did in fact stand my ground… I was told I would be getting the amount I deposited plus bonus funded to my account since you guys took over $2000+ from my balance and STILL was promised for a manager to contact me in regards of this situation. You are spinning the conversations that took place as if there was ever an agreement. Those funds were put in my account for the amount of $195 for the inconvenience until I talk to a manager because I was on hold for over 45 minutes trying to get a hold of one. So don’t go twisting what was said to me because I stood my ground and now you guys are going out your way to make up lies on my behalf. I have all the screenshots to prove so and I wouldn’t have came here if I knew that this problem wouldn’t resolved

Hello all again,

Thank you both for your replies.

Dear Lucky Legends Casino team,

It is common that a bonus ends or becomes real money and withdrawable balance after meeting the wagering requirements or by requesting a withdrawal. In the case of a "sticky" bonus, we know that the bonus amount is not withdrawable, and it is deducted from the winnings/withdrawals.

Was there any wagering requirement? If yes, did the player meet it? If yes, and it was not possible to request a withdrawal of a higher amount, what needed to be done with the remaining funds since she was limited by the transaction limit on the payment method used? She basically only accepted a withdrawal of a lower amount.

Since we have not been provided with the requested data that could prove the player played the restricted games during the meeting of the minimum wagering requirements before requesting the withdrawal in question, could you please confirm that the player did not play the restricted games before making the withdrawal request?

Why should the remaining (lost) winnings from the bonus, a few hundred exceeding the withdrawal of legitimately accumulated winnings, have any impact on the withdrawal in question?

"A bountiful win" is very relative and subjective. I believe it is quite a big amount for a regular player.

Please, look at my last messages outside of the thread, where I tried to explain the situation and our attitude, and if it is possible, provide me with the requested information and details.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Greetings all,

Just letting you know this is being discussed internally with the necessary parties and we will inform everyone here once a decision has been reached, thanks again for your patience and understanding.

Best,

Lucky Legends

Thank you branislav,

and yes I’ve waited and we’re patient long enough, I’ll be more patient please let me know if there is anything needed on my end I am happy to provide and answer any questions because I’m really just trying to move forward and be compensated for what I fairly won

Thank you both for your replies.

Dear Msmaniire,

Just letting you know that I saw a conversation between you and the casino customer support, where they informed you about the balance "reset". Please note if the casino reconsiders its decision, all the funds that you used for playing after the "reset" will be deducted from the disputed winnings.

Dear Lucky Legends Casino team,

We are still patient and positive. Feel free to inform us about any updates or news.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Hello thank you for quickly replying branislav, may I ask what you mean about a balance reset? I just want to clarify that the $2,000 that I requested was never put back on my balance therefore I was never able to play anything from it but you might be referring to something else?

I was just referring to the "reset", where the casino confiscated your withdrawal and returned your deposit back to your account, Msmaniire. Since you used the returned deposit and another bonus with it, in case the casino reconsiders its decision, these amounts (lost returned deposit and deposit bonus) should be likely deducted from the disputed winnings because you played with them after the "reset". It was necessary to submit a complaint after the "reset", you submitted the complaint only after you lost all the funds after the "reset" was made.

I saw you had not agreed with this solution. The casino simply did it and only informed you about it. But the returned deposit and deposit bonus were lost by playing, therefore, it should be deducted from the winnings.

So, let's please wait for the casino's response and update.

Oh my apologies branislav, yes I understand thank you for clarifying that… no problem

Greetings all,

We have discussed the matter extensively and will try to express the outcome as clearly as possible so all parties fully understand our position and the reasoning behind it.

The first issue (and reason for denial of the withdrawal) being that the terms and conditions of the casino and the bonuses themselves clearly state that all funds hold the rules of the bonus until after approval for withdrawal. At this time the associated non-cashable bonus funds (which even after completing playthrough cannot be used for "non-allowed" game play) are manually removed by the Approvals Department. Until the time of withdrawal approval and bonus removal non-cashable bonus funds given by the casino are still in play and hold all associated bonus rules.

Though the mechanics of the casino do not allow us to "lock" games or funds once the playthrough requirement is reached (funds must become "cash" in order to facilitate withdrawal) we as an organization have gone to great lengths to assure players are aware of this (and all) rule(s) both by listing them clearly in the terms and conditions of the casino and bonus listings and offers, then also forcing players to review and sign off on these rules before a coupon can be redeemed. For the moment and until further development by our gaming providers this is the best we can do within the casino platform we work with.

Casino.guru makes the excellent point that no unfair advantage was gained in this particular case by violating the rule and we see the merit in this, as the withdrawal request was made before playing non-allowed games and no further wins were requested for withdrawal after the prohibited play. Due to this fact after further review and closer scrutiny there would have been fertile ground to argue in defense of the player on that pretext.

That said, the big issue now becomes "double jeopardy". In spite of disagreeing to the cash re-deposit (plus deposit bonus) which was real cash with no playthrough and no maximums as to cashout you were fully informed as to the nature of the funds in your account and their associated rules Msmaniire. You then opted to play those funds with full knowledge of their origin. This play could easily have resulted in a much larger win, and had winning been the result the casino would not have contested those funds no matter how large the sum.

We feel a clear decision was made by you as a player, to play those funds and risk perhaps losing them or try for a better payout in the end. Once these funds were exhausted a complaint was filed.

Had the redeposited funds not been played and the complaint was entered contesting the casino's denial of the withdrawal much of what casino.guru holds at issue here would be within the scope of debate. The withdrawal was requested before additional "non-allowed" games were played and you as a player gained no advantage through playing them in this instance.

But playing the cash redeposit with full knowledge of it's origin constitutes acceptance of these origins. The casino took a tremendous risk issuing cash funds with essentially no rules, just as you as a player took the risk to play them and perhaps make a nice payday out of it. It makes it complicated on this end to argue the virtues of your situation. As we Americans say, it is "having your cake and eating it too".

For the sake of closing this ongoing issue we have been authorized to offer a one time $800 cash withdrawal to the player with no further deduction for the funds already played, in agreement to close the complaint as resolved. Otherwise we will unfortunately have to allow the complaint to be closed without resolution.

Best wishes,

Lucky Legends

Dear Lucky Legends

if that’s all you can do then I will take it because I do want this resolved and move on from it, I agree with accepting the $800 to resolve this complaint. What do I need to do to receive it asap ?

thank you

Greetings Msmaniire,

The funds have been re-deposited into your account, if you could re-request them for withdrawal (preferably via Coindraw) we will see what can be done to get those moving in your direction.

Best wishes,

Lucky Legends

Thank you lucky legends,

I have made a btc withdrawal request for the amount of $800 using Coindraw

Dear lucky legends casino,

Can you please confirm that the coindraw btc request has been received and that if there’s anything else needed on my end to avoid any delays the payment.

I apologize for the urgency but I have an emergency situation and the funds would help drastically right now. 🙏🏼

Thank You for your time

Greetings all,

We are very pleased to inform you that the transaction has been issued on our end and is confirmed delivered in Blockchain Explorer.

Best wishes,

Lucky Legends

I have received the funds ! Thank you Casino Guru, Branislav and Lucky Legends Casino.

looking forward to playing more at this casino

Thank you both for your replies and updates.

I am very glad that part of the disputed winnings have been paid out. However, since we are talking about a very specific case, in the meantime, I also discussed this solution internally with the team.

Dear Lucky Legends Casino team,

As we can see, the player accepted the withdrawal of a lower amount because there was no other option.

If she accumulated her winnings of $2,000 legitimately and did not breach any of the casino's rules until the time she requested the disputed withdrawal, what is the reason for confiscating anything more than her deposit and maybe the deposit bonus amounts after the "reset" from the disputed winnings?

The casino even could be glad that the player chose a payment method with a lower transaction limit. Otherwise, she would have requested a withdrawal of the entire winnings, which would have been more.

Could you please share with us the exact points from the casino's rules "that clearly state that all funds hold the rules of the bonus until after approval for withdrawal" or other rules that were breached before the user legitimately won her winnings following the casino's rules and requested the withdrawal?

Unfortunately, we see no reason for applying bonus rules after the wagering requirements were met and the winnings were already available for withdrawal. Even the system restrictions were removed at that point, and the withdrawal was already pending.

If there were winnings from the remaining $400, from restricted games, it would be alright to confiscate them. However, in this case, this amount does not play a role.

Is the casino please able to reconsider its final decision and restore the rest of the confiscated winnings with possible deductions, or restore them and provide the player with clear instructions on how to withdraw them?

I am afraid that if the casino insists on the provided solution, it will not be possible to close the complaint as successfully resolved.

Greetings Branislav,

Perhaps we need to state again that the ultimate issue is not with casino.guru's point regarding not benefitting from non-allowed games. We agree that in the case that this was the end of our story a settlement of the full amount would perhaps be in order, perfectly in accordance with the wishes of casino.guru as a 3rd party arbitrator.

The issue lies with the player accepting the terms of the casino's initial decision by playing the funds re-deposited into the casino account as cash. These funds were played with the intent to win and with full knowledge of their origin, had these no playthrough/no maximum cashout funds resulted in a win the complaint and the withdrawal request related to it would not exist. This was explained in our previous statement which included the offer of settlement.

After viewing the points on all sides the casino took into consideration both the obligations of the casino to the player and player to the casino. There was no intent at coercion on our part, we merely offered what we felt was reasonable to everyone given the complete circumstances.

At this point our position has been stated as clearly and succinctly as possible, the player has agreed and stated they are satisfied with the solution, and the funds have already been transferred. If casino.guru chooses to close this complaint as unresolved it is certainly their prerogative to do so and it is not our place to protest.

One might argue that if the player feels the matter is resolved, requests a resolution, the casino acts in good faith to complete that agreement, and the player states categorically that the matter is resolved a 3rd party arbitrator is not entitled to violate that agreement, but this is not our forum.

What we can state categorically is that regardless of the outcome on the part of the 3rd party arbitrator we as an organization (and perhaps the player as well) consider this matter to be closed.

It's been an interesting journey for sure.

Best wishes to all,

Lucky Legends

Dear Lucky Legends team,

Somehow my questions were not answered at all.

However, although it was written nicely above and the offer was presented as something super lucrative, a one-time cash withdrawal, with no further deduction, basically, at that point, $1,200 (we agree only with the deduction of $200 - deposit and a "sticky bonus") was already deducted from the disputed winnings.

In addition, we can play with words, but there were again (as it was in the case of her balance "reset") only 2 options - either to accept the casino's offer with a significantly lower amount compared to the winnings that she is entitled to or "Otherwise we will unfortunately have to allow the complaint to be closed without resolution" (so in other words - nothing). How would you expect a regular player would behave in such a situation?

The complainant came to terms with the solution of a lower amount only because otherwise it could mean she would receive nothing. Since I really cannot see such information anywhere - how did you find out that the player is satisfied with this solution, please?

What other options did the player have at the moment the casino confiscated her pending withdrawal of $2,000 than to use the returned initial deposit and use the allowed deposit bonus with it? It was already confiscated.

If the casino made the "reset", it confiscated the winnings/pending withdrawal that she was entitled to and that she accumulated legitimately and without breaching any rules, the casino basically did not have a reason to confiscate it (the casino even was not able to substantiate the decision with relevant rules, or it hid the confiscation behind irrelevant or unfairly/incorrectly applied rules), and as a final solution, it forced the player to accept a disadvantageous offer with deduction of $1,000 from her winnings, how can the casino consider it a good faith?

Basically, if the casino had done everything fairly and correctly at the time the withdrawal was still pending, nothing from the following events would not have happened. The casino was the one who decided to make a "reset" of the balance and let the player use the returned initial deposit and deposit bonus, while there was no justified reason to do it at all. So, I dare to claim that - as Americans say, "having your cake and eating it too" could be also used in a different way in this case.

Now I will just repeat the parts from my previous post.

"Is the casino please able to reconsider its final decision and restore the rest of the confiscated winnings with possible deductions, or restore them and provide the player with clear instructions on how to withdraw them?

I am afraid that if the casino insists on the provided solution, it will not be possible to close the complaint as successfully resolved."

Can you please confirm the casino's decision is final and remains unchanged?

We would like to ask the casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.

Greetings all,

We believe we have stated our reasoning to the best of our ability, acted in good faith with the player, and that the matter is closed at this point. There is no further comment on our end, thanks everyone for your time and energy, really.

Best wishes,

Lucky Legends

Thank you, Lucky Legends Casino Team, for your confirmation.

As was explained above, we do not agree with such a way of solution to the player's issue, and our attitude remains unchanged. This was clearly and unanimously agreed internally with the team. The player's winnings of approximately $1,000 were confiscated unreasonably. The player should be allowed to withdraw all the disputed winnings since she is entitled to them.

Dear Msmaniire,

I am sorry for your situation, and I understand your frustration.

Although you received a part of your winnings, a significant portion was confiscated, and we cannot accept this decision. Therefore, the complaint will be closed as unresolved, which will influence the casino’s rating in a negative way, and the disputed amount will be updated to the remaining $1,000 that you are entitled to.

The casino can reopen this complaint anytime, and you will be informed by email if the casino decides to change its approach and attitude and reconsider our recommendation to pay the rest of your winnings.

In case of any questions, do not hesitate to contact me at branislav.b@casino.guru.

I wish I could be of more help. I sincerely hope you will not come across a problem like this again.

Best regards,

Branislav, Casino.Guru